Sunday, December 28, 2008

Black Lesbians, White Women.


I have always said that black women are simply female versions of black men. I receive a lot of negative reactions from black women who are anti-black male when I state this, but I will contend that the differences between black women and black men are differences related mostly to gender as opposed to different socialization (which does play some role, but not as much as they would like it to play). Give a black woman higher levels of testosterone and switch her sexual orientation toward other women, and she will show many of the same characteristics of black men, good or bad. Look at Felicia "Snoop" Pearson; a former drug dealer who served 8 years for second degree murder of a black woman. Look and Shawntee "Da Brat" Harris who was sentenced to three years in prison for aggravated assault of a black woman. The former is openly homosexual while the latter is rumored to be the same. Missy Elliot has had such rumors and much of the way that she presents herself is similar to the stereotypical thuggish ways associated with black men.

This brings me to the point of this post.

As revealed in Divided Sisters: Bridging The Gap Between Black Women and White Women, there is a greater tendency for black lesbians to be in interracial relationships than is the case with heterosexuals. As with black men, they often are criticized for their high tendencies to have relationships with white women. From chapter four of Divided Sisters:

Many African American lesbians are quick to assign ulterior motives to others in their community who love White women. "Black lesbians who date White women are suffering from self-hate," says one Black lesbian named Rhonda. "They think some White woman is going to lift them up." African American scholar Brenda Verner similarly claims, "Like Black men who have become obsessed with white women, many black lesbian feminists are caught in the net of "jungle fever."

I love the irony. "Suffering from self-hate" and "they think some White woman is going to lift them up". These words sound awfully familiar. Here is more:

I was at a party with my White girlfriend, and this Black woman started hitting on me. When my White lover saw what was going on, she came over and sat next to me, kind of making it clear that the two of us were together. Well, this other woman, who was being so nice and friendly, all of sudden turned vindictive. Then, after finding out that I was president of NOW, she very snootily commented, "Oh, that's why you've got a White girlfriend."

And:

My Black girlfriend once dropped my hand when a group of radical Black lesbians walked in the room. It really made me mad, and I think her attitude about me being White was something that ultimately led to us breaking up. It is very hard on Black lesbians to have other Black lesbians accuse them of being politically incorrect, or betraying Black sisterhood.

The parallels are amazing and the point I am trying to make is that these black lesbians are black females, they are socialized from childhood the same as any other black female, yet when they develop a sexual orientation toward women and/or tend to be more masculine than normal, they seem to mimic many of the characteristics commonly associated with black men.

I guess one can now argue that when black women are homosexual, they "adhere to a European standard of beauty". I guess it is now correct to say that "white lesbians appreciate the beauty of black women more than black lesbians". We can go on. This just goes to show the repeated hypocrisy of the anti-black male crowd.

30 comments:

RainaHavock said...

Now that is pretty interesting.

Mista Jaycee said...

Real interesting post.
Jaycee

Anonymous said...

rocky, are you a closet homosexual?? do you wish you could get it on with a white man? is that why you're so angry with black women, because they have something black men will never have without surgery?

Mr Laurelton Queens said...

Nice topic

I have lesbo black female friends. The funny thing is half of them I know still have sex with black men.

It is really an interesting article.

Rocky said...

rocky, are you a closet homosexual?? do you wish you could get it on with a white man? is that why you're so angry with black women, because they have something black men will never have without surgery?

I'm not angry with "black women". But clearly you are angry with black men. So does your hypothesis apply to you yourself?

http://www.answers.com/topic/penis-envy

Rocky said...

I have lesbo black female friends. The funny thing is half of them I know still have sex with black men.

They're on the Down Low?

Grata said...

Rocky,

I had to come and visit your joint. And disagree with your hypothesis that Black Lesbians follow the European standard of Beauty.

I am not a Lesbian (Sometimes I wish I was). But I don't appreciate white female beauty the way I appreciate Black female Beauty. However I do find White men attractive but Like I mentioned at C1, this may have more to do more with the rules of probability and self preservation.
I met an AA man recently I found attractive, but he turned out to be a Paper man.

If its true that Black lesbians prefer White Women. Then that is really disturbing. And I can't think of anything else other than self hate. I am sorry. Alot of this whether one accepts it or not has to do with Oppression. In societies where there was no severe white Oppression, white beauty is appreciated in its own right but not over indigenous beauty.
Growing up I thought Indians where the most beautiful people even more than whites.
Where I come from you will never hear of appreciation of Blonds or blue eyes. Those freak people out.

Our appreciation of the other's beauty is akin to a vegetarian's appreciation of a well prepared meaty meal. You like the way its assembled and put together but don't want to eat it.

Anonymous said...

Interesting theory.

It does appear many black women are not feminine at all.

Rocky said...

Rocky,

I had to come and visit your joint.


Thanks for dropping by.

And disagree with your hypothesis that Black Lesbians follow the European standard of Beauty.

Why do you disagree? Are you saying that the book is wrong?

I am not a Lesbian (Sometimes I wish I was). But I don't appreciate white female beauty the way I appreciate Black female Beauty.

But you are sexually attracted to men and the point was the similarities between black members of different genders who are sexually attracted to women.

However I do find White men attractive but Like I mentioned at C1, this may have more to do more with the rules of probability and self preservation.

You know, Evia criticizes this alleged point with black men. She was addressed on why black men preferring white women was bad while black women preferring white men was fine. Her response was that black men always had some excuse for this (black women are hard to deal with, etc.), while the black women simply had a personal preference. Of course, I see Evia's statement as quite inaccurate and you are a single example of this inaccuracy. You are stating an excuse to justify your attraction/preference for white men; the very thing she accused black men of and criticized them for it.

With all due respect, I don't buy it. I believe that you like white men for the same reason that some black men like white women.

I met an AA man recently I found attractive, but he turned out to be a Paper man.

You still found him attractive. Thus, finding someone attractive apparently is not dependent on "rules of probability and self preservation". And could it be that you tend to view black men as "paper" even when they've done nothing to warrant it?

If its true that Black lesbians prefer White Women. Then that is really disturbing. And I can't think of anything else other than self hate.

So do you or do you not believe this to be true and why? Is the cited book wrong?

I am sorry. Alot of this whether one accepts it or not has to do with Oppression. In societies where there was no severe white Oppression, white beauty is appreciated in its own right but not over indigenous beauty.
Growing up I thought Indians where the most beautiful people even more than whites.


Where are you from that shaped you into believing that Indians were better looking than black people? Uganda? Isn't Uganda overwhelmingly predominantly black? Why did you appreciate Indian beauty over indigenous beauty? I'm from the predominantly white U.S. and I never thought that any other women were more attractive than black women.

Where I come from you will never hear of appreciation of Blonds or blue eyes. Those freak people out.

So why did Idi Amin love white women? Why is skin bleaching so prevalent in Uganda? Why are you attracted to white men?

Our appreciation of the other's beauty is akin to a vegetarian's appreciation of a well prepared meaty meal. You like the way its assembled and put together but don't want to eat it.

But this is contradicted by so much including your personal liking/preference for white men.

Grata said...

"You are stating an excuse to justify your attraction/preference for white men; the very thing she accused black men of and criticized them for it".

Black men where I am from too have that attraction to non black women, but that attraction rarely translates into marriage because of Cultural rules. My number one choice for a mate would be someone from my tribe out of community obligation. Other than that I prefer dating WM because I have a strong attraction to them. Since I am not in my country, chances of meeting a partner are slim so I have to settle for the other. And I still won't be seen as having abandoned the community even if I marry white.

Culturally for us a woman can get married anywhere. Since she doesn't pass on her blood line. The men do, so who they marry has to be compartible with the community and clearly a WW is not. Its simple power politics. Black Americans don't follow the rules but any society you find, they will be strict about the partners the men pick.

If Black men continue to marry out in higher numbers, that will be the end of the Black community.

This discrepancy on who should marry out and who shouldn't is actually about saving the community. The black women can not do it by themselves. But like I said, maybe the Black Community is meant to eventually dissolve. Black men marrying non black women is simply turnng their backs on the community. I don't see how you can argue otherwise.

Grata said...

"But this is contradicted by so much including your personal liking/preference for white men."

I am one of the rare ones. I guess I was raised on a Western Media diet.

Most traditional Africans appreciate white beauty from the sidelines. Not something they place above themselves.

And by the way the most beautiful people I have seen are not white. And the white people I have been attracted to are very plane looking. Its not the looks I go for but the whole. White men generally have a different temperament than black men which I find attractive.

Grata said...

"But this is contradicted by so much including your personal liking/preference for white men".

I forgot to mention that we don't put a premium on beauty like is done out here. We look at beauty differently. Its multifaceted. We are not a date driven cuture where physical beauty plays a big role. But the whole quality of the person is what matters.So just because we don't place White beauty as superior to ours, we still date white. Its the person. My culture is very much against vanity and beauty worshiping.
People appreciate a beautiful person but will be quick to bring them down to earth.

Rocky said...

Black men where I am from too have that attraction to non black women, but that attraction rarely translates into marriage because of Cultural rules.

I don't buy that. It rarely equates to marriage because there is no significant white population in Uganda. Lets compare. Black men in America live in a reasonably integrated society whereas white women outnumber them at least 6 to 1, yet only 6% are married to white women. Based on random colorblind pairing, roughly 75% of black men would be married to white women. So clearly, whatever attraction black men may have for white women (which is far less than you try to make it), it rarely translates to marriage.

My number one choice for a mate would be someone from my tribe out of community obligation.

Then it wouldn't be your number one choice. That would be the equivalent of the imaginary "only a black man" mantra that many of you IR promoters claim. The difference is that your tribe promotes an only a *name of tribe* man mantra. So in reality, your actual number one choice in men, absent obligations, are white men and based on the IR promoters, you suffer from self hate.

Culturally for us a woman can get married anywhere. Since she doesn't pass on her blood line.

That makes absolutely no sense. Biologically, a woman passes her bloodline just as equally as a man. The notion that only a man passes his bloodline is an old biological myth. And even if this was true, a man would pass his bloodline no matter who he procreates with.

Black Americans don't follow the rules but any society you find, they will be strict about the partners the men pick.

That's nonsense. In western societies, it has always been the woman's suitor who is scrutinized. It is he who traditionally must convince her parents that he is worthy of their daughter. In the African societies you speak of, the women had no pick of partners. She went along with whoever she is arranged to be with which often was the man with the largest dowry.

If Black men continue to marry out in higher numbers, that will be the end of the Black community.

What high numbers? 8 or 9 percent? Why do you and other like you keep perpetrating this fantasy that black men are marrying out in en masse? And black men marrying out threatens to end the white community more so than the black community. Socially, being white is based on being roughly 100% white whereas being black is based on simply having a percentage of black blood. Plus, black traits are genetically dominant over white traits at a rate of 4 to 1. And lastly, black women marrying out has the same effect as black men marrying out. Your notion that black men marrying out is more damaging makes no sense and you have yet to give any real reasoning behind it.

Black men marrying non black women is simply turnng their backs on the community. I don't see how you can argue otherwise.

I can argue otherwise because this notion makes no sense and you have yet to give a sensible reason for it. Black woman marrying white men has the same effect as black men marrying white women. As a matter of fact, children of black men and white women are more likely to be raised in the black community and thus maintain the traditions.

Most traditional Africans appreciate white beauty from the sidelines. Not something they place above themselves.

Same for African Americans, though I would bet that a growing number of Africans are not "traditional".

And by the way the most beautiful people I have seen are not white. And the white people I have been attracted to are very plane looking. Its not the looks I go for but the whole. White men generally have a different temperament than black men which I find attractive.

It's funny that you say this when over on C1's site, black men were being ridiculed for the exaggerated notion that they like fat white women. Maybe these white women have a "different temperament" which they find attractive.

camille said...

why does it seem like you generally do not like women? what do black or white lesbians have to do with black men?

LorMarie said...

Wouldn't it serve your interests to spend more time advancing AA men instead of worrying about what a so-called minority of black women are thinking? If it's such a minority as you say, why create a blog about it? With all embarrassing incarceraton, educational level, and unemployment rates, I'd say the AA male collective has more important things to work on. After all, what I hope to acheive among black women in general is self-determination and separate identity from AA men. In other words, you take care of yours and we will take care of ours?

As for your post, there probably aren't very many black women in the lesbian dating pool to choose from. Whatever the case, that's for lesbians to deal with.

The problem with black women is that we tend to think in terms of racial solidarity with black men. That has unfortunately reared it's ugly head in other aspects of black women's lives. When black women as a group rid themselves of thiking along those lines, we won't care about who others are dating.

Rocky said...

why does it seem like you generally do not like women?

I don't know why it seems to YOU that I do not like women.

what do black or white lesbians have to do with black men?

Well, if you read the post carefully you should understand.

Rocky said...

Wouldn't it serve your interests to spend more time advancing AA men instead of worrying about what a so-called minority of black women are thinking?

I'm quite confident that you have no idea how I spend my time.

If it's such a minority as you say, why create a blog about it?

Why not?

With all embarrassing
incarceraton, educational level, and unemployment rates, I'd say the AA male collective has more
important things to work on.


I would say that AA women have similar things to work on as opposed to black male bashing since (and note the parts in bold):

http://www.latinamericanstudies.org/latinos/label.htm

According to government data, 26 percent of Hispanic girls leave school without a diploma, compared with 13 PERCENT OF BLACK GIRLS and 6.9 percent of white girls.

The only group that has a higher dropout rate among all students is Hispanic boys. Thirty-one percent of Hispanic boys drop out, compared with 12.1 PERCENT OF BLACK BOYS and 7.7 percent of white boys.


And:

http://archive.salon.com/news/feature/2001/01/12/black_women/

Black women have been the hardest hit by the incarceration craze. More are now behind bars than at any time in American history. They fill jails and prisons in greater percentages than black men and are seven times more likely to be imprisoned than white women. For the first time in American history, black women in California and several other states are being imprisoned at nearly the same rate as white men.

And:

http://www.dol.gov/wb/factsheets/Qf-ESWM06.htm

2006 Unemployment Rates

WHITE WOMEN: 4.0%, BLACK WOMEN: 8.4%

White men: 4.0%, Black men: 9.5%
HISPANIC WOMEN: 5.9%, ASIAN WOMEN: 3.1%

Hispanic men: 4.8%, Asian men: 3.0%


After all, what I hope to acheive among black women in general is self-determination and separate identity from AA men. In other words, you take care of yours and we will take care of ours?

I will be interested in seeing AA women separate from their sons, brothers, fathers, uncles, etc. I doubt that it will happen.

As for your post, there probably aren't very many black women in the lesbian dating pool to choose from. Whatever the case, that's for lesbians to deal with.

The limited pool would be offset by the limited competition, so it all evens off in the end.

The problem with black women is that we tend to think in terms of racial solidarity with black men.

That's because they are the same race.

That has unfortunately reared it's ugly head in other aspects of black women's lives.

That's what you want to believe.

When black women as a group rid themselves of thiking along those lines, we won't care about who others are dating.

You will then begin crying about white men dating white women and Asian women.

And regarding your post on C1's blog (whereas he so bravely decided to censor my response), the idea that college educate women make more than college educated white women is a distortion:

http://www.iwpr.org/pdf/IWPRRelease3_29_05.pdf

When comparing the median earnings of all workers (regardless of work schedule or amount of time worked), college-educated African American women do earn slightly more than white women. This is likely due to the greater work effort shown by African American women who tend to work more than other women with the same educational background. Recent analysis conducted by the Economic Policy Institute shows that college-educated African American women work, on average, 1,923 hours per year, compared to the 1,734 hours per year worked by college-educated white women. “That disparity adds up to over a month of additional full-time work by African American women. With that level of work effort, it would be a tragedy if African American women weren’t earning more,” comments Avis Jones-DeWeever, Study Director at the Institute for Women’s Policy Research.

When you compare only college educate women who work full time, white women make more.

http://www.rachelstavern.com/?p=35

lormarie said...

"the idea that college educate women make more than college educated white women is a distortion:"--Rocky

You attempted (unsuccessfully I should add) to refute my assertion by bringing in a source that actually makes black women look like hard workers

"This is likely due to the greater work effort shown by African American women who tend to work more than other women with the same educational background."


What was the point in bringing this in? To show that black and white women would make the same amount of money if black women worked less? Does that hold true for the disparities between white men and black men? Well black women aren't alone in this assessment. So are Asian Americans:
http://www.asian-nation.org/model-minority.shtml
The results show that as a whole Asian American families have higher median incomes than White families. However, this is because in most cases, the typical Asian American family tends to have more members who are working than the typical White family.

Then you bring this in:

"They fill jails and prisons in greater percentages than black men and are seven times more likely to be imprisoned than white women."

The writer of the article is a black man. What he did was typical of a lot of black men. Here's why: black women do not control the media therefore, we have no input on the negative images of black men. Because black men have no ability to fight against racist white men, they turn their angst toward black women. In other words, this Hutchison guy decided to show that black women commit crimes instead of going after white men; the ones who are in fact responsible for saturating the media with racist images of black men. Perhaps you are different. In order to find out, here is a challenge: I once got into a discussion with a white nationalist man about contributions made to society. It's his opinion that white men have made virtually all the important contributions to the world and black men have done little if at all. In fact, he believes that any success a black man has can be traced back to a white man who helped him. To go further, he believes that black men will never advance to the level of white men. I did not argue his point since I refuse to argue on black men's behalf. Would you be willing to debate this guy on my blog about this very issue. That is, if you can keep the discussion strictly about black men and white men without referencing women regardless of race? I'd have to see if he's interested. Are you?

But back to the point. Since there are more black women than black men, should we not make up a higher percentage of the prison population LIKE we are on college campuses at higher percentages and numbers than black men? You mentioned percentages but are black men in prison at higher numbers than black women?

http://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/news/article/7609

"Over the past 33 years, black women have enrolled in four-year colleges at higher rates than have black men, according to the results of a new study conducted by the Higher Education Research Institute at UCLA's Graduate School of Education & Information Studies. In 2004, black women comprised 59.3 percent of all first-time, full-time black students attending four year institutions, compared to 54.5 percent in 1971."

I will be interested in seeing AA women separate from their sons, brothers, fathers, uncles, etc. I doubt that it will happen.

When I say we should have a separate identity, I mean black women should avoid thinking in terms of racial kinship with AA men in general. Black women should stop thinking in terms of what's good for her race and start thinking about what's best for black women and children. This has nothing to do with the men in her family since family is family. But, she should not think in solidarity with AA men as a whole. Notice I apply different names to each group referring to the women as black and the men as AA. That's deliberate on my part.

As I said, why not work on advancing AA men and black women will work on behalf of black women and children? If black women want to be even more successful than we are now, it would be best to "cut the cord" with black men and champion our own cause. This isn't about hate. I just feel that black men are no more socially kin to me than white, Asian, Latino, or Arab men.

RainaHavock said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
RainaHavock said...

Rocky: i had posted a comment but i decide to delete it and make a blog post about it. I'm not going to jump in this little conversation with you and Lormarie but just wanted to let you know it's giving me some ammmo so check me out in a few hours or so. I think you'll see what I stand on this. ;)

Rocky said...

lormarie said...

You attempted (unsuccessfully I should add) to refute my assertion by bringing in a source that actually makes black women look like hard workers

"This is likely due to the greater work effort shown by African American women who tend to work more than other women with the same educational background."


I actually did successfully refute your assertion. You disregarded the fact that black women work more hours and that undermines the general statement of "make more money". A higher percentage of white women work part time and take leaves of absence. If one is to make a fair comparison, one must compare black and white women who work full time.

Also, in any article of this sort, it is regularly stressed that black women work more hours out of necessity. More white women are married and the men they are married to tend to have higher incomes than black men. Thus, white women have less pressure to put in the extra hours. So it is more about necessity than greater work ethic.

What was the point in bringing this in? To show that black and white women would make the same amount of money if black women worked less?

The clear as day point was than when comparing black women to white women who work the same number of hours, white women have a higher average income.

Does that hold true for the disparities between white men and black men?

Does what hold true? When college educated black men are compared to college educated white men who work the same hours, the white men make more on average. The difference is that white college educated white men work more hours than similarly educated black men. Thus you not only have white men making more per hour, you have white men working more hours, thus enhancing the black male/white male income gap.
http://www.asian-nation.org/model-minority.shtml
The results show that as a whole Asian American families have higher median incomes than White families. However, this is because in most cases, the typical Asian American family tends to have more members who are working than the typical White family.


Ok, but we are talking about the individual incomes of college educated women, not family income. College educated Asian woman make more than college educated black women on average. Same goes for comparing black men and Asian men.

The writer of the article is a black man. What he did was typical of a lot of black men. Here's why: black women do not control the media therefore, we have no input on the negative images of black men. Because black men have no ability to fight against racist white men, they turn their angst toward black women. In other words, this Hutchison guy decided to show that black women commit crimes instead of going after white men; the ones who are in fact responsible for saturating the media with racist images of black men.

Aren't you being a major hypocrite. You embrace the negative media images of black men like you would embrace a lover and you made a post over on C1's blog that was Stormfront level. Plain an simple. You put down black men world wide and throughout history.

Perhaps you are different. In order to find out, here is a challenge: I once got into a discussion with a white nationalist man about contributions made to society. It's his opinion that white men have made virtually all the important contributions to the world and black men have done little if at all. In fact, he believes that any success a black man has can be traced back to a white man who helped him. To go further, he believes that black men will never advance to the level of white men. I did not argue his point since I refuse to argue on black men's behalf. Would you be willing to debate this guy on my blog about this very issue. That is, if you can keep the discussion strictly about black men and white men without referencing women regardless of race? I'd have to see if he's interested. Are you?

Been there, done that. I have long left behind arguing with white supremists. For one, I have learned that how white people feel about us is far less important than how we feel about ourselves. Being put down by a family member is far worse than being put down by an outsider.

Also whites supremists have much to back up their claims. Mr. Laurelton Queens discusses this in his latest blog. They can cite how whites have accomplished so much compared to non-whites. What do you have to back up your claims of black female supremacy over black males? You cite white accomplishments. "White men have done this while black men haven't". But you can't cite anything showing that black women would have done any better compared to white women. It is easy to compare male accomplishments because males throughout history have dominated and generally male accomplishments are place in the forefront.

But back to the point. Since there are more black women than black men, should we not make up a higher percentage of the prison population LIKE we are on college campuses at higher percentages and numbers than black men? You mentioned percentages but are black men in prison at higher numbers than black women?

Men of of all races are in prison at higher numbers than women. That is a fact of gender. You can't make direct comparisons with this, but you must make relative comparisons. Black men make up nearly half of the male prison population. Black women make up half of the women's prison population.

http://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/news/article/7609

"Over the past 33 years, black women have enrolled in four-year colleges at higher rates than have black men, according to the results of a new study conducted by the Higher Education Research Institute at UCLA's Graduate School of Education & Information Studies. In 2004, black women comprised 59.3 percent of all first-time, full-time black students attending four year institutions, compared to 54.5 percent in 1971."


http://education-portal.com/articles/Leaving_Men_Behind:_Women_Go_to_College_in_Ever-Greater_Numbers.html

Leaving Men Behind: Women Go to College in Ever-Greater Numbers

Nov 13, 2007

In the last three decades, women have come to form a solid majority of America's college student population. This is great news, but many others think this progress comes at the expense of college-age men, whose rates of postsecondary school attendance have stagnated.


So it seems that women going to college more than men is a phenomenon not exclusive to blacks. I have yet to see to putting down white men for not being as educated as white women.

When I say we should have a separate identity, I mean black women should avoid thinking in terms of racial kinship with AA men in general. Black women should stop thinking in terms of what's good for her race and start thinking about what's best for black women and children.

Sometimes it seems that women who think like this don't fathom that half of black children are males. And how are you going to do what's best for black male children when keeping them separated from black males (something that has shown to be detrimental to black male children). Black women tend to fail in raising black boys.

And your idea of 'gender separation' is so far fetched, it is a joke. The Amazons were myth and don't expect white society to embrace you like that. And to tell you the truth, the average black woman nor black man does not live life by some racial solidarity, but rather lives by a racial comfort zone. In other words, she is comfortable with familiarity of her race and ethnicity and that includes her relationships with men.

Notice I apply different names to each group referring to the women as black and the men as AA. That's deliberate on my part.

It's also pointless.

As I said, why not work on advancing AA men and black women will work on behalf of black women and children? If black women want to be even more successful than we are now, it would be best to "cut the cord" with black men and champion our own cause. This isn't about hate. I just feel that black men are no more socially kin to me than white, Asian, Latino, or Arab men.

You are again spouting Stormfront level jargon that is excessively hypocritical. I think that hate is not far behind.

Rocky said...

Cool Raina.

LorMarie said...

As I thought Rocky, you won't take the challenge because you can't. It is typical of AA males to attack black women because they cannot handle attacks from white men. I've seen it over and over how black males will go to multi-racial boards, bash black women...but when nonAA males attack AA men, they (AA men) usually get all frustrated and leave forums altogether. But I don't blame you, the guy I speak of is a PhD who is very well versed (although I don't agree with his views).

And lastly, I don't believe in black female supremacy. BLACK WOMEN ARE IN NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM SUPERIOR NOR INFERIOR TO ANYONE. What I believe in is black women admiring all men, not just black men. If you call that Stormfront, that's your problem. I stand by everything I've said. If you want to challenge what the IR bloggers proclaim about black men, go right ahead. But, you're going about it the wrong way.

Peace

Rocky said...

I don't accept the challenge because I don't care about white supremists. They talk crap, but that is about it. They are outside of the black community, and they don't run the mainstream media. They have no power. It is when our own people start cooning and acting like Uncle Ruckus that I view as despicable and I view hypocrisy as despicable. I have spent way more time arguing with white supremists (which OFTEN included defending black women). I stopped doing so a while ago because they were not worth it. I do debate with far right conservatives over on Free Republic, which OFTEN includes defending black women. But you will sit by and let a white supremist dog black men on your site knowing that this same white supremist probably equally despises black women? That is putrid.

And your very reference to black men throughout time and cultures is very much Stormfront level. You go beyond just wanting black women to admire all men. You want black women to abandon black men and chase white men because you view them as superior and you view black men as inferior. You simply skirt around the fact that if black men are inferior to white men, then that would mean that black women are inferior to white women. You can't pick and choose.

Anonymous said...

I normally don't respond to blogs such as yours or C1's but after reading all these comments here I felt compelled to respond and this might be off th topic also. Last time I checked we are all adults here. Having different opinions is one thing but these childish arguments are really irritating. If black women prefer white men that's fine there is no need to make contraditory messages or insult black men when you could just say that you prefer white men and vice versa for black men who prefer white women. End of story. I prefer black men but if I fall in love with a guy from another race I'm not going to make any excuses; its's love plain and simple and that goes for lesbians also. I'm sorry I just have to get this off my chest.

Rocky said...

If black women prefer white men that's fine there is no need to make contraditory messages or insult black men when you could just say that you prefer white men and vice versa for black men who prefer white women. End of story.

Bingo. I couldn't agree more.

Anonymous said...

Rocky,

the IRR sisters do not perceive white men as being intrinsically superior to Black men...far from it in fact!

Instead they see (and write about) Black men "rejecting" them for white, light, and Latino women and this wounds them deeply as it isnot only romantic and sexual rejection in their eyes but especially racial rejection!

The scorned 'sistas', who already have issues with colour and hair texture, then seek out white men with whom to form what we see as romantic unions but are instead RACIAL ALLIANCES in which the white male is a silent partner!

It's an unspoken contract in which the Black female promotes white male superiority over the Black male in exchange for a symbolic honorary white status.

The stress this 'contract' causes Black women is immeasurable and so they seek to displace it onto the men who continue to occupy their hearts...Black men!

Thus, we must interpret all of their IRR work as sub-conscious distress signals or SOSs'. Thing is, only a Black man could possibly read the signal correctly. White boys would never have a clue!

Menelik Charles
London England

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Gina Rossi said...

This is a very interesting and exciting blog. I am a queer white woman who is attracted to AA women, since an early age I adored the women of En Vouge, Tina Turner etc. In my experiences in the queer lezbo dating/club scene though, I did not notice AA women having an overwhelming desire to be with white women.

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