Tuesday, January 11, 2011

Squares, Geeks and Nerds, Oh My!

Over on Von's blog there is an ongoing theme that is an attempt at attacking the commonly expressed criticism of black women’s choices in dating. The criticism is directed at what many view as the strong tendency for black women to be attracted to a certain type of male who is commonly referred to as “the bad boy” or “the alpha male”. This type of male is often broken down into, among others, the categories of “thugs” and “players”.

The criticism usually expresses the common repercussions of such a trend. “Bad boys” tend to be less committed to children and relationships, live more risky lifestyles, are less focused and stable, etc. But women often find such guys to be exciting and will defend such choices based on the acceptable idea that “man (or woman) does not live on bread alone” and on the natural evolutionary bases of this attraction.

I believe that most men understand that on top of good character, a man must have some appeal beyond just being a good guy. We understand that the inclination of women to be attracted to dominant, aggressive and even violent males is rooted in nature, but if this is to be understood, then should we not similarly be understanding of the fact that the male tendency toward multiple sex partners is similarly rooted in natural evolution? Yet, male polygamous based infidelity is treated with far more scorn than female hypergamy and the subsequent hypergamous based infidelity that commonly results. Should we not similarly reference the need to move away from base desires for the benefit of developing stable civilized societies?

Beyond this, Von and others attempt to defend alpha male/bad boy love by tossing ad hominem attacks at its critics. Her most noted one is implying that such critical men are those who are social misfits and/or are visually unappealing. The idea is that they are resentful of being routinely passed over by the more desirable women and that their criticisms are based on such resentment. With this notion being put forth, I decided to investigate, beginning with an example of an individual who expressed the viewpoint that much of the behavior of men is shaped by the mating choices of women and women should refrain from dating the more thuggish types. This particular young man grew up middle class in a loving two parent home and attended Morehouse College. Here is his quote:

"American women have issues. Black women are the backbone of our families. If every Black woman got together and said, "We're not gonna date guys unless they have PhDs. We're not gonna date guys unless they have a Master’s [degree].”
Guess what? In due time, n****s will stop selling dope and they'll start going to college. It's that simple."

"Just like if I want to have all the hoes on the block and be a pimp, I got to get all the women's backing first. Then I can get all the dudes to come to any party I want them to come to. Look at strip clubs. You take all the women out of strip clubs and see how popular the strip club becomes. You tell women to stop dating dope dealers and you’ll see how cool dealing dope becomes."

These quotes are some of the controversial statements made by Polow Da Dom in interviews. Now let's take a look at this "nerd":





Now I'm no real expert on what women find appealing about men, but I will take an educated guess and say that Polow would generally be considered a good looking guy. He quite apparently spends some time in the gym and he seems to me to be what many would call a "pretty boy". I wonder what kind of social life he leads.




Well, it appears that this "geek" does interact with rather pretty women. Maybe this is a fluke shot. Let's look again:





Hmmm. This "square" managed another photo with a very pretty celebrity at some high class event. Has he taken more?:





Well, this is odd. I thought that the opinion that Polow expressed was strong evidence that he is ugly, a loser, a geek, a social misfit and a nerd. But the truth is that he is a well know rapper, singer, songwriter and millionaire super producer. As a matter of fact, Billboard labeled him as the number one Hip Hop producer of 2010. This is the same man who purchased a Porche Panamera worth over $100,000.00 as a gift to his cousin Monica to congratulate her on her new album.
Even looking at the Black Men Vent episodes on Youtube, I don't see nerds and geeks. None of them are ugly. I don't see social awkwardness. They seem to interact rather comfortably with the ladies they are debating. Some of them have children from previous relationships. What I see are regular guys who put a lot of thought into a particular issue and are very vocal with their opinions.

Now lets take a look at a nother view of "nerds". Here is an article from the The Spearhead discussing the reaction to his criticism of a video game service which charges men to play video games with women:
"The transition of video games from a niche hobby to a mainstream pastime that occurred in the past decade has wallpapered over many of the more sordid realities of the gaming community. It’s not a stretch to say that most
hardcore gamers are nerds, and while not all manginas are nerds, almost all nerds are manginas.
Remember the brouhaha over Pro-Male/Anti-Feminist Tech’s science fiction article back in October? The hordes of sniveling dweeboids who screamed bloody murder over his piece on blogs, forums, and The Spearhead’s own comment section were doing what
they do best – kissing the tails of the less-fair sex in vain hope of a little tail being tossed their way. Your average gamer is a servile sack of snot who will roll over and beg for a woman who so much as brushes him in the
hallway."

Here is another article deeply critical of nerds:

"Nerds are manginas. Keeping in theme with the previous paragraph, a man whose ideal woman is basically a dude with breasts and a vagina is a man who will likely allow women in general to walk all over him. Afraid of confrontation and used to bowing and scraping, nerds place themselves at the mercy of women in the vain hope of getting laid. Also, male feminists are overwhelmingly nerds – see pansies like Hugo Schwyzer and Barry “Ampersand” Deutsch."
Here is a comment from someone reading an article related to this topic:

"I can’t remember if there was any sort of formal statistical study done, but I do remember reading a story awhile back discussing how nerdy men often end up marrying attractive women (my husband — a rather nerdy but lovable engineer —
got quite a kick out the article). Part of the reasoning behind such paring is that these ‘nerds’ tend to be nicer and more respectful to these women than their more hunky counterparts. Of course there was mention of greater success, stability, personality and the like as well."

"It would be interesting to see how the woman’s education level matches up with the man’s in these cases. Do these women tend to be higher educated as well, so they have greater preference for men who are on par intellectually, regardless of looks? Or do you get more of the dense trophy wife effect?"— Casey


Now while I don't agree with "nerd hate" (there is nothing wrong with being a nerd), it does make sense that nerds would tend to be more pro-feminist and be more defending of women. Nerds tend to be your classic "nice guys" in the sense that to compensate for their lack of things like swagger, charm, assertiveness, style, etc., they tend to be extra nice to women. They are quick to jump to a woman's beck and call and will defend feminist ideals. They may envy the popular guys who get the pretty girls, but it is typically outside of their nature to be resentful and misogynistic. So in all likelihood, guys who are critical and hard on women are the furthest from being nerds. How often do we see nerdy wife batterers?

It would be difficult for people like Von and her cohorts to acknowledge that it is quite possible than those men who are vocally critical of black women's choices do so due to honest observation and being socially aware of how black women's dating choices and other behaviors contribute among other things to the destruction of the black family. Such an acknowledgement would require an open mind.

82 comments:

Anonymous said...

It's amazing how Von's haters are the main individuals reading her blog. She is doing good work. Von didn't just dissect criticisms from black nerds, she used their own words to do it. She showed how hypocritical black nerds are. What right do they have to flap their mouths about black women's choices when they ADMIT chasing beautiful "hoodrats", rejecting decent women, only to get angry when they are rejected? They are doing the same thing they accuse black women of doing.

Von hit the nail on the head. Black women don't owe black men, nerds, geeks, whoever anything, least of all their attention.She also said that black women should take responsibility for their choices. Maybe the men need to change the type of women they pursue.

P.S. Polow the don is not a good-looking guy. LOL. Weird how you, a man, would try to judge other men and tell women what we find good-looking. Even if a man is physically attractive he still has the ability to be ugly on the inside (behold your black man vent friends).

Those pics of Polow are old. He is FAT now and he often looks like he needs a bath. Most people wouldn't stick him in the "geek" category. As far as the world knows he doesn't date black women. Those pics you posted are of his friends, nothing more. I doubt most women would be interested in him if he wasn't rich and a hip hop producer. He is not an attractive man.

Rocky said...

It's amazing how Von's haters are the main individuals reading her blog.

A bit hypocritical being that you are apparently reading mine.

She is doing good work. Von didn't just dissect criticisms from black nerds, she used their own words to do it. She showed how hypocritical black nerds are. What right do they have to flap their mouths about black women's choices when they ADMIT chasing beautiful "hoodrats", rejecting decent women, only to get angry when they are rejected? They are doing the same thing they accuse black women of doing. Von hit the nail on the head.

Uh, no she didn’t. The entire point went completely over your head. The point is not what words she dissected. The point is her labeling folks of a certain opinion “nerds”. Her goal simply was to label black men with certain opinions with a term that is typically viewed negatively. She had no proof that these men are “nerds” or “geeks” or “social misfits”. She simply pulled the notion out of her ass.

On the other hand, I actually showed something concrete. I showed a Hip Hop super producer making the same argument; a man that even you couldn’t deny was NOT a nerd. I showed the men from Black Men Vent making the same argument and nothing about them indicates that they are nerds. I gave quotes from people who have observed “nerds” as being the complete opposite of what you and Von assert; that being more pro-feminist and more accommodating of women than normal men. You constantly going on about black men being hypocrites is a straw man.

Black women don't owe black men, nerds, geeks, whoever anything, least of all their attention.She also said that black women should take responsibility for their choices. Maybe the men need to change the type of women they pursue.

Who said anything about anyone owing anyone anything? What discussion are you having? It’s interesting that a common opinion around the web is that black men have lower standards with regard to how women look and white men have the highest standards. White men want Barbie Dolls and black men are accepting of a variety of looks and sizes, including extra large. I agree with the guy Von quoted as saying that it is more common to see nerdy white guys with pretty women than it is to see nerdy black guys with pretty women. This is something that I have observed for years and even Von once stated that it is more acceptable for white men to be “corny”.

Roslyn Holcomb claims that this is because those white guys have more money, yet you can see this same dynamic on college campuses with full time students (with no income). Then Holcomb makes a claim about her “white friends” as if that supports anything.

P.S. Polow the don is not a good-looking guy. LOL. Weird how you, a man, would try to judge other men and tell women what we find good-looking.

Lord knows how many times women have dispute me when I have declared a particular woman to be attractive. Anyhow, I did specifically state that I’m no expert on what women view as good looking and I specifically stated that I was taking an educated guess. I’m sure though that if Polow expressed opinions that you strongly agreed with, he would look better to you.

Even if a man is physically attractive he still has the ability to be ugly on the inside (behold your black man vent friends).

“Ugly on the inside” = expressing views that you don’t like.

Rocky said...

Those pics of Polow are old. He is FAT now and he often looks like he needs a bath. Most people wouldn't stick him in the "geek" category. As far as the world knows he doesn't date black women. Those pics you posted are of his friends, nothing more. I doubt most women would be interested in him if he wasn't rich and a hip hop producer.

Well, he has a personal trainer now and has declared that he is going to shave his beard and start dressing better. The point is that he is neither a “geek” nor a “loser”. I’m sure that he has a wide selection of women at his disposal and he criticized black women’s mating choices.

Anonymous said...

@Rocky

Polo is NOT an attractive man. I know beauty is in the eyes of the beholder but if he didn't have money and if he wasn't successful many women would probably consider him a "loser" and unattractive.

Just saying...

You cannot tell women what is attractive and appealing to us. Polo is not a physically attractive man. No matter how much weight he loses and how often he shaves he still wouldn't be physically attractive to me. His rant about black women just adds to him being unattractive to me. The only thing outstanding about him is his success, which is why I said without it many women would consider him a "loser."

As for your black man vent friends it's very clear they suffer from flawed ugly personalities. I let my husband watch one of their videos and he came to the same conclusion. His exact words were "men don't carry on that way."

I don't have a problem with black men addressing black women's issues (because I know black women don't have to listen). I do however recognize men with ugly personality flaws that put women off being that I am a woman. The man who Von quoted is one of those men. He feels entitled to the very best black women and he's clearly frustrated that they don't feel the same way about him. That is a personality flaw. It's almost like a child pouting because he or she cannot have their way. It is turning women off and he's too self-centered to see it. The same with your black men vent friends.

"This is something that I have observed for years and even Von once stated that it is more acceptable for white men to be “corny”."

Von also pointed to the stereotypical behavior of black men and how it is now expected by some black women. She used the word conditioning. Black men have no one but themselves to blame for the twisted image of black masculintity.

Have a good day.

Kid W/Golden Arms said...

The truth is for black men the "nerd" or "geek" label does not stick at all. We have to be more well rounded than other ethnic groups of men simply due to how we look and often how we are raised. Most intellectual black folks dont fall into any category. this whole "nerd" vs "jock/bad boy" is something some of the women use to justify their choices in terms of who they date and the consequences there of.

Some of the women who use the labels and try to force men into the position, ie a variation of "a real man would..." None of the women would say it to the mans face, especially if they want something....von aint gonna turn down polow da don or even a cornel west type dude if they gave her or her girlfriends the time of day..

Andrew said...

Hey Rocky

I found this comment interesting.

"Black women don't owe black men, nerds, geeks, whoever anything, least of all their attention.She also said that black women should take responsibility for their choices. Maybe the men need to change the type of women they pursue."

Why does she think they owe us anything? I don't think you owe us anything. It seems like it is the "other way around". Didn't she say "Black men checked out" as if to say "we owe them something". That was her "words" wasn't it?

What do you really contribute to black men? I am confused by this Hood rat! You contribute your vagina so we must "bow to you". CHILD PLEASE! You can't even get a man to marry you or settle down with you for a serious relationship.

According to her "Black women don't owe black men anything". LOL
OH REALLY, don't ask black men to take you anywhere movies, shopping and etc! I am perfectly fine with that. Come out your pocket you hood rat!

Ask Indigo how that whole "Philosophy" of I am independent and don't need any help got her.

I am perfectly happy with that arrangement. I don't understand these women. Why go after successful black men??? Then, I am wrong when I lay the "hammer" on them.

We are not on television, magazines, interviews crying about no "good men around". They are not good black men because they don't "simp" for you.

The girl is so stupid. She puts up a picture of Lance in comparison to me a "regular Negro". Lance wouldn't look twice at her ATL hood rat ass!

Since Von seems to be the authority on good looks. Tell her to put her "picture up".

From what I see of the BWE bloggers they are middle aged and obese. But got the nerve to attack black men like me.

Good post Rocky. (Smiling)

Things are picking up in this blog game. LOL

Rocky said...

Andrew, you are on point. Nobody declares that black women owe us anything. This is another example of a made up argument. And yes, the whole constant complaining about black men "checking out" or the complaining about black men dating and marrying white women shows that they believe that we owe them something.

Rocky said...

She puts up a picture of Lance in comparison to me a "regular Negro".

I'd like to see a picture of her in comparison to his ex, Eva.

Julia said...

Dear Rocky,

"Polow Da Don"? What kind of name is that? The man is unattractive. Period. No amount of weight loss or change in wardrobe can make this man attractive. He would only be a hit among women who are looking for guys with money.

No offense, but I rarely pay attention to those on Black Men Vent. They come off as extremely bitter. There is a thin line between venting and complaining. I consider their website to be the counterpart of B.W.E. blogs.

They are too hard on nerds. I would take a man who is a nerd over some aggressive jock any day. I prefer geeks but nerds are just as good. They are more genuine and gentlemanlike.I would feel more secure in a relationship with them.

"...than those men who are vocally critical of black women's choices"
Everyone is entitled to their opinions. At the same time, If you are limited to a certain number of people or social class, I think you should recognize that and not group X amount of people into one club. I personally can't say that I grew up with thugs. However, I do recognize my limited expose to those outside of my social class.

"...how black women's dating choices and other behaviors contribute among other things to the destruction of the black family."
This not a black woman thing but rather a woman thing. White females are often in the same shoes when it comes to raising black kids. Non-black females aren't excluded from the "single mother" trend.

People such as Halle Berry, Barack Obama, Boris Kodjoe, Sophie Okonedo, Denise Matthews, Mariah Carey and Shemar Moore are all Bi-racial celebrities who were raised by their single white mothers and had their fathers walk out on them.
It makes you wonder if it's their choice in mate or the pool of men as a whole. Obviously white females are in the same boat as black females.

I'm not playing the blame game but it is something people should look into. I don't place the blame solely on black females. Clearly their choices in males must be as poor as white females since both parties have the same fate when it comes to their black children.

There are way too many case of single motherhood and not enough of a man making his lady an honest woman. That has a lot to do with people not practicing safe sex or having sex with people they don't love and have no intention of staying committed too.

Overall, Great Post!

-Julia

Rocky said...

So you view Polow as a physically ugly man Julia?

Anonymous said...

@Rocky

A lantern jaw on a man is as masculine and attractive as large wide set eyes are on a woman. Polow is an attractive man. Only thing is I heard he was short. Thats never a good thing for a guy. He has put on some weight but that doesnt matter. On a scale of 1-10, I would give him a solid 7.

On another note, I think the greater hazard for black women to date risky men is that she inevitably gets pregnant by them which creates a class of victims due to her mating choices. Personally, black men running after hood rats, attractive hood rats, are more benign than black women eventually getting pregnant by the indifferent bad boy. Thats the quintessential difference.

These girls need to accept that the consequences of their sexual choices, as women, are different from men. There is a reason why, historically, the sexuality of women has always been controlled. She doesnt have the eggs to waste on low status men. She has a smaller window in which she can procreate with the most desirable man.

Rosyln Holcomb is an idiot. I just dont understand how a group of women can make a case for black women do run behind white men but think it so progressive to be indifferent to black men despite being related to, having the closest contact with, and most likely to romantically involved with a black man.

Kigali

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous

As a black woman, you owe black men as much as you think they owe you.

Kigali

Anonymous said...

@Kigali

I don't think black men owe me anything and I certainly don't owe them nothing! You spoke too soon!

Julia said...

Dear Rocky

Ugly is not the word I used. But, If you are putting it that way, than yes, I find him to be ugly.
He is not good looking. His whole body language gives off a prison look or someone who is a thug or in a gang. Majority of his pictures look like a mug shoot because he scowls in every single one.

As I look more at him, he looks like a Doberman Pincher. Just one with a lot more weight in the face.

Polow Da Don would be attractive to gold-diggers and thug lovers. Any woman who wants a good guy and someone she can proudly bring home to her parents, knows better than that. I would never shame my family. Actually, I probably won't have a family! My parents would disown me if I was even friends with a guy like that.

Kigali, I have to disagree. Lantern jaws are attractive on SOME males, not every male can pull it off. This man is one of them. On a scale of 1 to 10, I would rank him a 1 and that's being gracious.

-Julia

Rocky said...

To Julia:

One thing to note regarding your list of bi-racial celebrities whose fathers "walked out on them" is that all were born in wedlock. The so called “abandonment” came as a result of divorce. Their mothers were not women who were knocked up by men who had made no true commitments to them. Also, in a couple of those cases, their fathers were foreigners and this adds another element to the so called “abandonment”. Often times, foreign men go back to their home countries after divorce creating great distances.

I believe that you are a bit unfair to Boris Kodjoe in that his mother and father divorced when he was six, yet he states that he maintained communications and a relationship with his father.

Also, the list of bi-racial celebrities with close relationships with their black fathers is larger. This includes folks like Mýa, Tiger Woods, Jason Kidd, Derek Jeter, Jasmine Guy, Mario Van Peebles, Dwayne “The Rock” Johnson, Rick Fox, Shane Battier, Jennifer Beals, Clark Johnson, Persia White, Jordin Sparks, Kimberley Locke, Lonette McKee, Amerie, Adam Lazarre-White, Carmen Ejogo, Downtown Julie Brown, Kidada Jones, Leona Lewis, Rain Pryor, Rashida Jones, Sydney Tamiia Poitier, Tony Parker, Wentworth Miller, Gina Belafonte, Jaye Davidson, etc.

Thanks for commenting Julia. Your thought provoking opinions are always welcome here.

Julia said...

Dear Rocky,
Yes but their mothers were left to raise their children by themselves. Often where black females are left with their kids. Which was my initial point. Black females have it worse since their kids start off having a nonexistent relationship with the father and the men feel no commitment towards them or the child.

Boris Kodjoe was used as an example of those who grew up with single white mothers or broken homes. Which was in reference to your comment on black women and their choice of mate effecting the black family. A family that doesn't consist of a two parent household.

A problem that the black community has right now.

My point was that many bi-racial celebrities also grew up in single parents households and those such as Halle Berry (poster child) and Mariah Carey have poor relationships with their father.
Which would show that it's not a black woman thing but rather a woman thing when it comes to single mother households.

My original comment wasn't in reference to their relationship with their dad but rather the status of their household. I should have stated my argument better but you have clearly made yours.

I was not aware of that many Bi-racial celebrities. Interesting.

Also, Alicia Keys parents weren't married.

Overall, most people in those generations had two parent homes.

-Julia

Julia M. said...

Just to add on..

" Thanks for commenting Julia. Your thought provoking opinions are always welcome here."
The pleasures all mine! There are very few bloggers who welcome other opinions and can have conversations/debates without crossing lines. I applaud you for that.

For the record, I never aim to be that "oddball". Unfortunately, it happens way too often! :D

Anonymous said...

@Julia

"Kigali, I have to disagree. Lantern jaws are attractive on SOME males, not every male can pull it off. This man is one of them. On a scale of 1 to 10, I would rank him a 1 and that's being gracious."

Thank you! Polow is UGLY. I would give him a -5. Rocky tried to use him as the poster child for this blog (alone with the mentally disturbed men of black men vent) and it failed miserably. He actually proved Von correct. Some men need money to get women's attention.

You stated it perfectly Julia. The only women that would be interested in Polow are gold diggers and thug lovers. I would add they have to like FAT thugs because Polow is short and fat.

http://gossiponthis.com/2009/12/04/polow-da-don-throws-afterparty-for-chris-browns-fan-appreciation-concert-at-club-opera-in-atlanta/

It is understandable why he has issues with black women. They probably wouldn't give him the time of day if he didn't have money, which would explain his bitter attitude.

This blog is an epic fail. Find a good looking black man, who doesn't have mental issues like those Black Men Vent men, that shares Polow's thoughts about black women. And don't try to tell us he is good looking, let us judge that for ourselves. Good luck!

Decent looking, moderately successful, black men don't have these issues. I grew up in a household with five brothers who never had a problem connecting with black women. Each one of them is married to a black woman.

The "venting" or "complaining" is usually reserved for the physically unattractive, social outcast, and mentally disturbed black men. The rest do very well with women.

Rocky said...

Julia

I see your premise as being that white women make the same bad choices in black men that black women do, but I don't think that you are supporting this premise. You are basing this mostly on examples of divorce, yet the divorce for blacks, while a little higher, is very similar to the divorce rates for whites. It's like 12% of black couples divorce every years while 10% of white couples do the same.

The statistic most black women use when trying to show how black men "abandon" their children is the 70% out of wedlock birth rate. Only 20% of black single mothers had been been divorced:

http://www.projectsinglemoms.com/singlemomsinamerica/statistics.html

So citing cases of divorce (which is the case with all but maybe one of your examples) does not support the idea that white women make the same bad choices of black men that black women do. Having a child for a man who had already become your husband is a smarter choice than having a child by a man who has not married you. It's just that even in marriage, you have men who walk away but the chances of this happening are greater when the man is not married to the woman.

Also note that Faith Evans' white father walked out on her before she was born. Tamia's white father walked out her leaving her and her family to grow up in the projects. Michael Phelps, Tom Cruise, Angelina Jolie, Demi Moore and Matthew Perry were all "abandoned" by their fathers at very young ages and most of their single mothers had to struggle.

Rocky said...

Thank you! Polow is UGLY. I would give him a -5. Rocky tried to use him as the poster child for this blog (alone with the mentally disturbed men of black men vent) and it failed miserably. He actually proved Von correct. Some men need money to get women's attention.

Well, another commenter gave him a 7. Thus you are simply stating your own biased opinion. Second, even a 5 would mean average looking.

Also, it is clear that Julia is basing his looks mostly on how he presents himself and her opinion of his character, which is interesting. It goes to show how women judge looks based on their feeling toward the individual's character and presentation while men can separate physical looks from the opinion on character. No matter how ignorant, triffling, silly, stupid, etc. a woman is, if she is fine and good looking, she is fine and good looking. Naomi Campbell looks damned good despite being a damned fool. I guess this is related to how men can separated sex from emotion while women have difficulties doing this.

What's comical is when you stated that if he had not become a millionaire producer, he would have been a loser. That's basically like telling someone that if they were not a winner, they would be a loser. That's a laughable statement.

I doubt that the guy was a loser before his success. He was a student at a top tier university. He was supposedly viewed as a pretty boy and ladies man in high school. You can't make someone a loser because that is what you want him to be. Face it. The notion that people making this particular argument are ugly nerds and losers has been thrown a monkey wrench. You may not like the men from Black Men Vent, but clearly they are not nerds, geeks and they don't appear to be "fuggly" or even ugly from what I can see. Just regular guys. Andrew looks like a regular guy to me. Von just wants him to be ugly because she needs to resort to personal insults to compensate for her poor arguments.

And several female aquaintances of mine read some of Von's blog and said that ladies don't say the things that she does. So there you go.

Anonymous said...

@Rocky

"Thus you are simply stating your own biased opinion. Second, even a 5 would mean average looking."

Get your eyes checked. I gave Polow a NEGATIVE 5 (-5). As in FAR below average. I could argue that the individual that gave him a 7 is biased because she tends to defend black men regardless. When I'm wrong I admit it. 2/3 women here have said he is unattractive.

"What's comical is when you stated that if he had not become a millionaire producer, he would have been a loser. That's basically like telling someone that if they were not a winner, they would be a loser. That's a laughable statement."

You don't seem to know women very well. In essence I admitted the SAMEthing Julia admitted.

She said she can only see thug lovers and gold diggers being attracted to Polow. I said without money he would be a viewed as a loser and/or unattractive to most women and it's true. He would be just another ordinary unattractive black man venting his anger at the world because women can't see past what's in front of them. Nothing comical about it. You might not believe women care about looks but believe me we do.

"He was a student at a top tier university."

What? Morehouse College is NOT a university. It is a college and FAR from top tier. In fact it's not even close to top tier. I suggest you go research that.

"The notion that people making this particular argument are ugly nerds and losers has been thrown a monkey wrench. You may not like the men from Black Men Vent, but clearly they are not nerds, geeks and they don't appear to be "fuggly" or even ugly from what I can see. Just regular guys. Andrew looks like a regular guy to me. Von just wants him to be ugly because she needs to resort to personal insults to compensate for her poor arguments."

This is laughable. You are a MAN and you are judging the physical ATTRACTIVENESS of OTHER MEN! Do you not see anything wrong with that?

It's natural for me and other women to say, "Polow is unattractive" but YOU, I assume, a heterosexual man, CANNOT tell us what is attractive, which is exactly what you are trying to do. Face it, you picked an unattractive man to try to prove something Von said incorrect.

The men of black men vent clearly have issues with their personalities. I watched some of their other videos on Youtube and they carry the exact same entitlement issues as the man Von quoted. They act just like spoiled children who pout when they cannot get their way. That is NOT attractive in a man and I think YOU need to face it. Even if they are physically attractive they are ROTTEN on the inside, which in my opinion is ten times worse than an physically unattractive man.

And I'm sorry, Andrew is God awful ugly. Polow is physically attractive compared to Andrew. No offense to Andrew, I'm just being honest.

"And several female aquaintances of mine read some of Von's blog and said that ladies don't say the things that she does. So there you go."

(Blank stare) Okay, I don't see your point. This is the internet people can say whatever they want! I respect Von's honesty. It's refreshing to see someone not give a damn what other people think. She says what a lot of people do think and I have had conversations with my own friends to know that WE DO TALK about those things. Your "female friends" don't represent the general consensus of women in this world! You and the others here continue to read her blog so whether you think she's a "lady" or not you find her opinion interesting enough to keep reading and blogging about HER opinion.

Menelik Charles said...

Wow, at the risk of coming across all Rupaul on you guys, the idea that Polow is "ugly" is simply outrageous! Just say you're not attracted to him and have done with it, why don't you?

For the record, I think the brotha is above average in looks. Now Little Wayne...

Menelik Charles
London UK

Anonymous said...

@Rocky,

Julia knows I love her but she isnt looking at this objectively, nor is our friend "Anonymous." They may think Polow is ugly but if you were to ask most black women, they would say he is attractive. They certainly wouldnt say he is ugly.

He looks especially handsome here.

http://radiofacts.com/2009/03/03/producer-conference-held-in-phoenix-polow-blaze-khalil-and-more/

Kigali

Anonymous said...

@Kigali

Please have your eyes checked dear and stop posting OLD pictures of this man. I have no idea why you and Rocky posted OLD pictures of this man.

Here are MORE recent pictures of Polow

http://bossip.com/311850/polow-da-hip-hop-grizzly-adams-gets-his-own-day-and-brings-out-the-stars-to-celebrate-turkey-day-in-the-a12006/

http://bossip.com/311850/polow-da-hip-hop-grizzly-adams-gets-his-own-day-and-brings-out-the-stars-to-celebrate-turkey-day-in-the-a12006/bigboipolowluda/

http://bossip.com/311850/polow-da-hip-hop-grizzly-adams-gets-his-own-day-and-brings-out-the-stars-to-celebrate-turkey-day-in-the-a12006/polowrichboigregstreet/

Nothing attractive about him. It is not Julia and I who are not being objective. You cannot force this issue. The camera doesn't lie. Even when he was slim he wasn't an attractive man. Like I stated before he always looks like he needs a bath and shave to me. I highly doubt most black women would find Polow physically attractive. They might find his success and stardom attractive but his physical appearance? I don't think so.

Rocky said...

I highly doubt most black women would find Polow physically attractive.

Look at the bulk of the female comments made about Polow at this website.

Anonymous said...

@Rocky

Sorry but that proves nothing. Like I said before this is the internet.

I can just as easily throw up a blog/forums with comments bashing Polow's physical appearance...

http://www.lipstickalley.com/f154/any-tea-polow-da-don-234160/

http://bossip.com/186395/breezys-after-party-polow-da-don-are-you-on-steroids/

http://straightfromthea.com/2010/09/09/polow-da-don-is-on-a-mission-to-shed-the-fat/

I would suggest you survey a diverse group of black women about this topic because as already noted 2/3 right here on this blog said he is unattractive. And please use a CURRENT photo of the man.

Anonymous said...

@Rocky

Here are some more comments with people saying the exact same thing I'm saying, he needs a bath and a shave!

http://sandrarose.com/2008/05/photos-of-the-day-530/

http://bossip.com/241508/some-morning-fug-12/

Andrew said...

Let me respond to that rat VON.

I hate to burst her bubble but she got an afro and calling me ugly. We already know why YOU don't put up a picture.

Secondly, I could careless of black women thought um the ATL producer was ugly, fat or whatever. I have seen black women with unattractive men period.

They justify it as oh "he got swag or he got "game". It is all subjective. One black woman may "like you" and another girl might not.

I see plenty of black women "all the time". Some guys like an unattractive girl with a big ass or big butt. They don't give a damn if her face looks like "VON".

Tell Von to get off my dick. She sounds like she loves me or something.

I will comment on everything else.

Andrew said...

(Putting my I Phone down)

Listen you BWE bloggers are not Naomi Campbell, Tyra Banks, Nia long, none of that.

Lose weight before you run your mouth about any black man, whether it be the rapper or whatever.

From what I have seen of BWE bloggers, they are an obese mess! They know who I am talking about.

I think, I have seen Julia's picture and she looks better than all of y'all put together. At least Mike ain't pick no "homely" black girl.

I don't cosign sellouts either. If its true, it just is.

The VON hood rat is so tough she afraid to put her picture out there. She blocks her facebook and twitter. She literally hides from her "own friends".

She will continue to keep hiding as long as I am around!

(Smiling) Why do I care so much, when I am getting what I want.

Now, if you was "stopping" me from getting black women. That would be a problem for me. But it hasn't hindered me at all. A matter of fact, some black women have said you are such an asshole. I don't know why women even deal with you.

I respond by saying because " I don't lie or sugar coat shit. They hate me but love me at the same time. You're ugly but these black women "sleep with you". You make your "god damn" self look bad. How you are going to sleep with a man you are not attracted too?

THEN, run around and call the man "ugly" after YOU fucked him. Man let me leave that for the "New Album". These black women are playing games man.

Man, when I release that new album. I am not holding back this time around. I don't care if you say black men are bitter or whatever. " It makes a man unattractive if he vents". CHILD PLEASE, You wig wearing hood rat! It is unattractive when you beg "Black men" to help for every god damn thing. But we don't say nothing! Even when you offer your raggedy "vagina" to us.

Just shaking my head at Rocky. I am sorry man. I got to go in on them. I won't go any further. Just don't touch that stove. I just let black women bloggers know. Stay in your little lane talking about "white men worshiping or hair care or something".

Don't get out of your lane.

Lose that belly and "rolls" and then come back and "talk" about black men! When I see that happen. Maybe I might have some respect for you. But if you a little fat girl with problems getting a date. Man don't fix to put my name in your mouth like the hot dogs you like you to eat.

It is like responding to "Precious". Who gives a fuck who she "likes' and who "she dislikes".

Thats how it feels to me with this discussion.

Oh "Precious" like Tall, Light skin black men not you Laurelton".

Uh so?

(Heading out the door) Tell Von don't do locs, she would still be a hood rat. Very few black women can pull off "locs". Sorry that ain't you baby!

Oh yea, everyone have a nice day.

Rocky said...

Anon

You post a bunch of links to folks commenting on how raggedy Polow looks. You know, with the unkept beard, hair and shabby clothes. That doesn't make him "ugly". It makes him "raggedy". That can be remedied in an hour or so with a trip to the barber or hairdresser. Quick shave and a change of clothes.

The added weight likewise doesn't make anyone ugly. Ice Cube has always been chunky. Sinbad has always been chunky. That too can be remedied in a few months.

Clearly the man simply didn't care in the past couple of years. He went through a stage of not really caring about how he looked. That can be evidence of overconfidence. The bottom line is that his BASIC LOOK when he keeps himself up has been mostly described very positively by women. Thus, he is an example that throws a monkey wrench in the fabricated idea that only geeky, ugly black men criticize black women's dating choices. Plain and simple.

Julia M. said...

Dear Rocky,
You're being modest, I failed miserably.

It's actually kind of sad since I'm trying to figure out where I was going with that.Back to the drawing board!

Yes, I went based on his overall presentation. I don't find him physically attractive and he reminds me of an overweight Doberman Pincher but his presentation and thuggish style puts the nail in the coffin. To be attractive is not solely a physical thing to me.

If Polow Da Don is a "pretty boy" or handsome, the standard has been dropped. I agree with the Anonymous, he is not attractive. I thought you opposed the glorification of thugs. Why are people that this thug is handsome/attractive?

He's the complete opposite.

" I guess this is related to how men can separated sex from emotion while women have difficulties doing this."
That is the problem with men and women today. Too many are taking emotions of out of sex and end up being tied down (via babies) to women/ men they can't tolerate outside of the bedroom.

-Julia

Julia M. said...

**Why are people saying that this thug is handsome/attractive?

Julia M. said...

Dear Anonymous,
" Thank you! Polow is UGLY. I would give him a -5. Rocky tried to use him as the poster child for this blog (alone with the mentally disturbed men of black men vent) and it failed miserably. He actually proved Von correct. Some men need money to get women's attention."
That's funny but I wouldn't go that low. Spare the poor man's feelings.

I think Rocky was misinformed on who women generally find attractive. Contrary to popular belief, a lot of black females don't find thugs attractive. He would have been safer with Will Smith, Morris Chestnut, or Common.

Yes, that is true. Some males are unattractive and if it wasn't for flashy clothes and cars, most women would over look them. Women can be shallow like that. My taste in males is more about his aura and vibes. I'm more of a spiritual lover in that sense.

-Julia

Kid W/Golden Arms said...

Cant take what these women say at face value regarding men, women rarely, if ever, go out of there way to bash a dude who they think is unattractive. They only talk about these men if those men try to date said woman.

Women have dismissed men who they thought were out of their league and used the "ugliness" as an excuse to hide the fact that they dont want to compete.

Anonymous said...

@Rocky

Clearly you read what you wanted to read. Some women come straight out and describe him as fugly and ugly. Even in the pictures YOU posted he looks unkempt and not clean. Those braids he wears don't fit him. The beard just looks sloppy. The weight just put him over the top.

Ice Cube and Sinbad have ATTRACTIVE FACES and their weight is proportional. I would describe them as HUSKY, not fat. They aren't SLOPPY like Polow. I don't even know how you can compare them to him. As much as black men go on about black women's weight you should be able to see how laughable the comparison is and see the difference. Look at Polow's pictures in the links I posted and look at Ice Cube and Sinbad. There is no comparison.

Polow's weight is just plain disgusting. Polow is the male version of the woman who portrayed Precious. There is no point in arguing any further about it. I completely agree with Julia, he is not attractive and the ONLY type of women I can see drawn to him are gold diggers and thug lovers.

@Andrew

Sorry I'm not your messenger. Anything you want to tell Von you need to man up and tell her yourself. Her twitter account isn't blocked. I know because I'm one of her followers. Maybe she just blocked YOU. It's interesting how you go on and on about her looks when NONE of us know what she looks like or her real name, which I believe you need to find her on facebook! Good grief, think about the crap you write. You contradict yourself so much that much of what you write comes across as incoherent. You need to seek help dear. Your obsession with her is not healthy.

And PLEASE learn how to use quotation. You use quotation INCORRECTLY and it's glaring.

Have a good day.

Rocky said...

Jeez, I can't understand the difficulty you two are having. I am speaking solely on his physical appearance BIOLOGICALLY. I'm not speaking of his character, thuggishness, sloppiness, bad hair do, etc. Let's try this.

If his biological physical self was EXACTLY as he was on the pictures I posted, yet he was a born again, conservative, community activist, pro black woman school teacher with a conservative haircut/low fade dressed in a stylish, yet conservative business suit and had one of the nicest personalities of any human on Earth, would you look at him and say that he was bad looking or PHYSICALLY ugly?

No you wouldn't. To try to keep turning it back on how he CHOOSES to dress and his hip hop persona is a dodge and you know it.

Julia, I would hope and expect that you will at least be honest in answering the question. The Anon is a Von disciple or Von herself tossing out BS.

Rocky said...

Polow is the male version of the woman who portrayed Precious.

LOL. You have now verified 100% the need to not take you at all seriously.

Andrew said...

(Picking up my coffee)

Von or her "follower said this"

"@Andrew

Sorry I'm not your messenger. Anything you want to tell Von you need to man up and tell her yourself. Her twitter account isn't blocked. I know because I'm one of her followers. Maybe she just blocked YOU. It's interesting how you go on and on about her looks when NONE of us know what she looks like or her real name, which I believe you need to find her on facebook! Good grief, think about the crap you write. You contradict yourself so much that much of what you write comes across as incoherent. You need to seek help dear. Your obsession with her is not healthy.

And PLEASE learn how to use quotation. You use quotation INCORRECTLY and it's glaring.

Have a good day."

(Throwing my coffee at you)

YOU MONKEY go get her! Tell her go put her picture up since you are a big fan!

All of a sudden, you are talking about her twitter ain't blocked. How the fuck you know that?

Listen, you go tell that monkey put her picture up before she ever talks about me or black men again!

She won't even put up her own "fiancée". She puts Lance up there. You don't got no type of pride or respect for your own man.

I wish my girlfriend would put pictures up of another man around. I would smack her ashy face!

He don't even have to look like Denzel Washington. He don't even have to look Lance. Just be proud of the spouse you are with. WTF is wrong with these black women.

I am not looking for that hoodrat VON on facebook. I got better things to do. The girl said she wants to get locs. No disrespect, when they start talking about that "natural" look talk. It is sign of not wanting to compete with other attractive women. So they starting Aw' you black men are brainwashed by Europeans and etc. CHILD PLEASE

I respond to them by saying wasn't you wearing a god damn weave and mini skirt when I saw you the other day. Are you simple or something?

You must be a "mutt".

For the record, as much as I dislike BWE bloggers. I really don't get on them about looks and etc. I don't shy away from it either. I don't make it my mission to judge them on their looks. I won't tolerate a "Precious" type blaming black men for her dating problems.

I do have a problem with morbidly obese BWE bloggers or ATL hoodrats with NO picture themselves speaking on black men.

Again, go run to VON and ask her when is she putting up her picture.

You GROUPIE!

Anonymous said...

@Andrew

"I am not looking for that hoodrat VON on facebook. I got better things to do. The girl said she wants to get locs. No disrespect, when they start talking about that "natural" look talk. It is sign of not wanting to compete with other attractive women. So they starting Aw' you black men are brainwashed by Europeans and etc. CHILD PLEASE."

You are so dumb! Did you not say that Von's facebook is blocked? SO you were looking for her on facebook stupid!

Also Von is getting married who exactly does she have to compete for? She has her man! I don't think you realize how unbelievably dumb you come across. You contradict yourself over and over again with your IRRATIONAL rants.

Let me get this straight, if a black woman embraces what is God Given or her natural hair texture it's because she doesn't want to compete with other attractive women? LOL. That has to be the joke of the day. One minute ugly black men like you are lamenting about weaves now you're lamenting about naturals!

The truth is black women who embrace their natural hair tend to be MORE comfortable with their appearance than those walking around with relaxers, weaves, and perms. A black woman walking around with her natural hair on full display is usually CONFIDENT. Those women don't usually have to compete for anyone's attention because they get it regardless because it's so rare to see a black woman embrace their natural hair. LOL. Good grief, you are dumb as bricks.

And so what if some women don't want to compete against other women. The playing field is NEVER even. There are some people who are perceived as more attractive than others. It's senseless for any woman to base her own sense of beauty on the "competition" around her.

Oh and @Rocky why are you blocking my comments. Can't take the heat?

Anonymous said...

@Julia

"If Polow Da Don is a "pretty boy" or handsome, the standard has been dropped. I agree with the Anonymous, he is not attractive. I thought you opposed the glorification of thugs. Why are people that this thug is handsome/attractive?

He's the complete opposite."


I completely agree.

"I think Rocky was misinformed on who women generally find attractive. Contrary to popular belief, a lot of black females don't find thugs attractive. He would have been safer with Will Smith, Morris Chestnut, or Common."

Exactly, but Rocky won't find a Will Smith, Morris Chestnut or Common looking black man who shares the feelings of Polow Da Don and Black Men Vent. He needs to face it.

@Rocky

"would you look at him and say that he was bad looking or PHYSICALLY ugly?"

My honest answer is yes. Looks are what usually draw us to an individual FIRST. Polow is not my type. I don't find him attractive physically. His face doesn't scream attractive to me. I'm not looking at his persona or the way he's dressed. I'm looking at the man himself, in the flesh, and I don't like what I see. He is not a physically attractive man.

"LOL. You have now verified 100% the need to not take you at all seriously."

You're in denial. I will say it again, YOU CANNOT TELL WOMEN WHAT WE FIND ATTRACTIVE or HOW WE DEFINE ATTRACTIVENESS.

Julia M. said...

Dear Rocky,
" If his biological physical self was EXACTLY as he was on the pictures I posted, yet he was a born again, conservative, community activist, pro black woman school teacher with a conservative haircut/low fade dressed in a stylish, yet conservative business suit and had one of the nicest personalities of any human on Earth, would you look at him and say that he was bad looking or PHYSICALLY ugly?"
I'm going to be truthfully honest with you and I do hope you take my word on it.

Subtract all of what he is now and add on all of what you said and I still would find him physically unattractive.

As stated by Kigali, he has a lantern jaw but seems to have some sort of overbite/slight overbite. It makes his face look like it has a snout. His nose doesn't really help the equation because it looks kind of bulbous and adds onto the snout-ness. Thus my reference to a Doberman Pinscher.

I personally am more attracted to males who have of a round jaw compared to a square one. An example of that is Common.

Also, his eyes aren't proportioned with his face. They look to be set really far back or maybe it's because his mouth and jaw look to be protruding out. Men who have "bedroom" eyes are sexy to me but Polow's look hard and empty. His eyes are also very chinky for his facial structure. I should expect it due to his dual heritage (half Asian) but it just doesn't fit him.

His body isn't up my alley because I don't like men who are too buff. I prefer slim and muscular males. Some males can get away with it but Polow is a little more prison buff. Even with the weight, I find that he looks like a linebacker. Someone such as Dwayne Wade and Paul Walker would be more of my type because they are muscular but slim.

If he was the man you described, he would be more attractive than what he is now. I wouldn't call him unattractive because a lot of the factors you mentioned would add onto his attraction and make up for what he physically lacks.

An example of that is Maxwell. He isn't physically good looking but he is attractive to me.

All of this kind of makes me uncomfortable. I've never really had to defend why I find someone unattractive.

Anyways, Have a good night everyone.

-Julia

Anonymous said...

In the opinion of this black woman, Polow is not ugly. He is looking pretty wacked right now with the bum look and the belly, but back during the time of the video below, he had it going on. He's not the best looking guy I've seen, but he is very far from the worst.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1DJQi2c67s

Anonymous said...

@Anonynmous

"Exactly, but Rocky won't find a Will Smith, Morris Chestnut or Common looking black man who shares the feelings of Polow Da Don and Black Men Vent. He needs to face it. "

Why not? Will Smith was snubbed by Peppa from Salt N Peppa in favor of Treach, the thug.

Kigali

Anonymous said...

@Julia

No, Polow looks like a mercat. He is still attractive though. I mean if he were over 6ft and I saw him walking down the street, I would think he was quite attractive.

Kigali

Anonymous said...

@Kigali

"Why not? Will Smith was snubbed by Peppa from Salt N Peppa in favor of Treach, the thug."

This is hearsay and even if it is true Peppa (a "hoodrat") supposedly snubbed Will Smith for a man more along her likeness Treach (a thug). I don't see the problem here. Obviously two of a kind found each other.

I don't hear Will Smith venting and complaining about black women or Peppa for that matter, which proves my point.

Anonymous said...

@Rocky

We can agree to disagree. I didn't mean to take up too much of your comment section. I will see my way out.

Andrew said...

Von and her followers still running their mouth.

She said this...

"Also Von is getting married who exactly does she have to compete for? She has her man! I don't think you realize how unbelievably dumb you come across. You contradict yourself over and over again with your IRRATIONAL rants."

It should be against the law to marry a "rat".

Let me see what else you said..

"Let me get this straight, if a black woman embraces what is God Given or her natural hair texture it's because she doesn't want to compete with other attractive women? LOL. That has to be the joke of the day. One minute ugly black men like you are lamenting about weaves now you're lamenting about naturals!"

Who says I lament about either. I said the locs would not look good on ATL Hood rat Von's ass period. How about perm one of half of your head and keep the other side an afro! I would like to see that you dumb monkey! That solves the problem you confused Indigo "twin"!

You know I don't care what a black woman's hair look like. If she got a shapely body, fat ass and thick thighs I will mess with her PERIOD! Her hair could be falling out. I just care how fat her ass is, thick her thighs is and if she cute. She don't got to be no model. I don't really pay attention to all that hair care crap!

She could be bald for all I care. I have spanked black girls and their damn wig fell off. Perhaps if they kept their hair natural. Black men wouldn't have to laugh when your damn 'wig" falls off during sex! I actually fell off the bed in MID STROKE on the floor laughing when her wig fell off. Why the fuck I got to deal with that!

You said this....

"The truth is black women who embrace their natural hair tend to be MORE comfortable with their appearance than those walking around with relaxers, weaves, and perms. A black woman walking around with her natural hair on full display is usually CONFIDENT. Those women don't usually have to compete for anyone's attention because they get it regardless because it's so rare to see a black woman embrace their natural hair. LOL. Good grief, you are dumb as bricks."

A black woman walking around natural is "confidant" and blah blah. I have seen bald headed, afro wearing black women doing the natural.

You know what they say " I am too broke to do my damn hair"! Got nothing to do with that Afrocentric crap you are trying to "sell" the readers here. Just say look man, "Negros ain't helping me get my hair done anymore". Man " I am just doing the natural thing now". Don't give us that "pro black" game man.

You stupid hood rat!

I have to head out. I hope Von don't bring that damn kinky hair to her wedding. If I was her fiancée, I would literally walk out of the church and say "bitch get your hair done or I ain't marrying you". You won't shame me in front of my family with afro/pubic hair on your head! Momma like "why her hair ain't done". You got me messed up! Her African Fiancee won't walk out because he needs his green card. Personally, I couldn't do it.

Let me respond to Julia. You got a white husband stop lusting after basketball players. Mike should smack you for that. Mike don't deserve that. This is what I am saying right here.

(Giving a dap to Rocky) I am driving out man.

Look for that New single Player's Anthem. I plan to release The "Pimp Doctrine too, How to love and control a black woman.

I am not playing games with these black women anymore.

Rocky said...

This is hearsay and even if it is true Peppa (a "hoodrat") supposedly snubbed Will Smith for a man more along her likeness Treach (a thug). I don't see the problem here. Obviously two of a kind found each other.

How is it hearsay when it came directly from her mouth?

And Peppa grew up middle class in a two parent home. She is really not a hoodrat.

And we don't hear Pepa venting about how no good black men are.

Anonymous said...

@Rocky

You know how many rumors and lies some of these black women believe about celebrity black men? The way they talk about Wesley Snipes, for instance, you would think he was a serial killer going around strangling black women. I read that interview that he did in the 1990s. That interviewer was begging him to say something negative about black women. They were begging for it.

Its like every time these magazines get a hold of a black man who dates inter racially they ALWAYS have to ask him about that. They ALWAYS have to goad them into saying something negative so they can run with their "Niggas aint shit" mantra.

They cant even imagine a black female celebrity, like Peppa, like Lauren London (another bi racial raised by a black mom and a white father lusting after thuggish black men) like Mya (apologizing for black men who are "forced" to see drugs to eat and her admiration of that) truly exist.

Black men have to dance and wiggle around questions concerning himself dating inter racial, these black women are LOUD and PROUD about their desire for thugs. No one ever calls them out on it.

Wow, so a black man dating a white woman is more amoral than a black woman dating a black thug? Thats black feminism for you.

Kigali

Julia M. said...

Dear Andrew,
"Let me respond to Julia. You got a white husband stop lusting after basketball players. Mike should smack you for that. Mike don't deserve that. This is what I am saying right here.

Excuse Me?

Lusting after basketball players because I find Dwyane Wade's body to be attractive? I never stated that I had a crush on him. At the same time, I won't deny that his body is ideal. Paul Walker is another (white) man I listed who has an ideal body to me.

Michael and I don't get all touchy when it comes to celebrities and who we like/find attractive. If that was the case, I would upset about a few of his celeb crushes.

Really, that's what you suggest men do, smack their wives? Wow.

It's not that serious.

-Julia

Mr Laurelton Queens said...

Dear Rocky

Good post man. Peppa is Jamaican.I never heard of her turning down Will Smith. Jada Pinkett turned down Will Smith for 2pac (we can debate later if he was thug or not).

You can't put black men in one box concerning thuggery. Some of the most intellectual or nerdy black men are "thugs" with a pen. For example Russell Simmons.

They say the "pen" is mightier than the sword. Once you reach a level as a black man and gain wealth. You are no longer a thug. You are a business man.

You become vulnerable to "real thugs".

Now let me get to black women. You are mentioning Pepp, Mya and etc. You have to understand most black women are attractive in comparison to non black women. (That is just my opinion). Even the chubby black women are attractive. So I can understand black women saying why black men would be with a homely fat white girl.

So this idea that nerdy, geeky black men can't get a fine woman. That is simply a joke. Ryan Leslie got black women all over him. I am not hating on him. But he is not no " R Kelly or Tyrese".

That is Urkel singing; but the black girls love him.

The little black girls drop their panties for these up and coming rappers like Travis Porter and "YG" the cali artist. They drop their panties for Soula Boy too.

I don't know why my daughter likes them. They weigh like 110 pounds soaking wet. The tastes change for black women.

I remember a Beanie Sigel (Looked like Marcus Garvey a big guy though) type black man came into a Jamaican restaurant with me and my Aunt.

These old Caribbean women went crazy over this guy. My aunt started flirting with him. They were overtly sexual in Jamaican restaurant. These were "older black women".

My aunt is like 5ft9 170 pounds. She got his phone number and left.

You can never assume all black women like the "same type of man".

Julia M. said...

Dear Kigali,

He does but I just thought a Doberman fits him a little better. Either way, both animals have a snout and that's basically what he has. It's awkward.

As for liking thuggish men, they are a complete turn off. You don't have a snowballs chance in hell with me. No one says that these women don't exist but how many of them are roaming around? I don't think they are in the majority and for one who does like a thug, there are probably three who don't.

Most of the "women" who say that are actually immature young girls. Lauren, Mya and Pepa were all in their early 20's when they said that stuff. Ask them when they get into their 30's/40's and the answer will be different. It's sad because young immature girls feel this way and get left with a baby when they do. Then they want to change their ways when they finally mature and see those "thugs" for exactly what they are... losers.

To tell you the truth, thugs scare me. I don't find hyper-masculine males attractive at all. You should be masculine but there is a thin line and you can turn me off quickly if you are hyper-masculine. I prefer males who are confident in their manhood and don't need to brag, boast and where it on their sleeve because in reality, it shows that they are insecure.

Too many black females are conditioned to think that black males get white wives once they make it. It's a stereotype but many of them expect it from black males. That's why Denzel gets the glorification he does. He's a great actor and a very handsome man but his black wife is large apart of his success with black woman. The same goes for Barack Obama.

Some black females can be shallow and insecure like that.

I've never really paid much attention to Wesley Snipes. He personally isn't attractive and he kind of scares me at times. He always came off as too aggressive and very controlling.

-Julia

Julia M. said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Mr Laurelton Queens said...

Julia

You are talking crazy again. You just said your panties gets wet for Dwayne Wade. Basically having wet dreams while you sleep next to Mike. That is disgraceful Julia.

"Lusting after basketball players because I find Dwyane Wade's body to be attractive? I never stated that I had a crush on him. At the same time, I won't deny that his body is ideal"

You should be admiring Mike, you are married. Again he should "back hand you" for even mentioning a black man. Then again, you might like that.

Yea, I suggest a husband should smack his wife, just don't leave a mark. I prefer you tackle your wife on the bed. I am not into the "smacking". Tackling is always better. I use to watch Wrestling and I liked one wrestler's move it was called the "Spear". You run forward and knock her on the bed. Sometimes when she is not looking.

Obviously, I am 5ft10 200 pounds. I don't advocate hurting your woman. It takes some experience to do the spear 'correctly" to a black woman. Some Negros will straight hurt her ass. You should knock her " on the bed" and be careful not to let her bounce to the floor or the wall.

If your wife is a "Big girl". Wrestle her big ass on the bed. I plan to discuss that on the next upcoming album on how to love and control a black woman.

Black women only seem to understand you being "physical with them". The white folks "mistaken it" for "domestic abuse".

In the black community and Hispanic community this is what "these women" understand. You can't be a "soft man".

Anyway, Julia stop disrespecting Mike and touching yourself thinking about Dwayne Wade. I am seriously disappointed in you.

Good day.

Anonymous said...

@Andrew,

"Anyway, Julia stop disrespecting Mike and touching yourself thinking about Dwayne Wade. I am seriously disappointed in you."

Really unnecessary.

Kigali

Menelik Charles said...

Von said:

Nerds tend to be your classic "nice guys" in the sense that to compensate for their lack of things like swagger, charm, assertiveness, style, etc, they are quick to jump to a woman's beck and call and will defend feminist ideals. They may envy the popular guys who get the pretty girls, but it is typically outside of their nature to be resentful and misogynistic.

So in all likelihood, guys who are critical and hard on women are the furthest from being nerds. How often do we see nerdy wife batterers?

Menelik says:

it appears as though this lady is attempting to contribute to a recent attempt (in the last few years) to construct a new paradigm in which those Black men who make valid criticisms of Black women's dating choices are emasculated (what a sweet matriarchal move this is!), patronised and described in ways suggesting they actually lack a masculine physical appearance, and are, therefore, physically feminised! Add to them an academic education and, hey presto: you have your nerdy Black man!

A brilliant demonstration of passive-aggressiveness on the lady Von's part!

Moreover, from this point on that we need not ever consider any Black man described as such as having a valid point as regards Black women's choices, and general behaviour: they are merely bitter bitches, at best!

Unfortunately, this re-characterisation of generally educated Black men (which differs greatly from how they're perceived by other women) is increasingly gaining favour as the 'something screwed crew' attempt to counter all legitimate criticisms, and insights, with lies and distortions in order so as to safeguard their fragile matriarchal egos.

Just saying.

Menelik Charles
London UK

Andrew said...

Dear London you make a good point.

The rat said

"Nerds tend to be your classic "nice guys" in the sense that to compensate for their lack of things like swagger, charm, assertiveness, style, etc, they are quick to jump to a woman's beck and call and will defend feminist ideals. They may envy the popular guys who get the pretty girls, but it is typically outside of their nature to be resentful and misogynistic. "

Oh yea, since nerds are doing this, why even the white nerd don't pick their ass for marriage or a serious relationship? Allegedly, they love a nerd now in a recession. I bet you would love a nerd when shit is "hard" for you out there.

She even said the so 'called nerdy" black men are checking out on black women too. Then, turn around and say "you feel black women owe you something".

The stupid rat just said "we are checking out" as to "imply" that we "owe them something". It is the "other way around". So what if we are checking out. Are we required to "check in"? Go chase a white man with dirty sneakers. Perhaps, he will "check in".

She went on and on defending the fact black women don't have kids with thugs and criminals.

So, now the nerd is dropping them with wayward kids to raise alone. That is adding "insult" to injury. A thug and a nerd is dropping your ass! Perhaps, change something about "yourself".

She is an idiot and the rest of them are idiots.

They can whine until the cows come home.

Once again, black men are not complaining about DATING. We are getting what we want "nerdy" or not.

Stupid losers.

Anonymous said...

@Menelik Charles

What are you talking about? None of what you quoted came from Von. That came from Rocky.

Rocky said...

What are you talking about? None of what you quoted came from Von. That came from Rocky.

I think that he knows that and mistakenly typed "Von" instead of "Rocky".

Anonymous said...

@Rocky

"I think that he knows that and mistakenly typed "Von" instead of "Rocky"."

Yeah, a mistake that he REPEATED in his rant about passive aggression. Neither Menelik Charles nor the idiot Andrew read YOUR post Rocky. SMH.

Menelik Charles said...

Anonymous said:

What are you talking about? None of what you quoted came from Von. That came from Rocky.

Bro Rocky said:

I think that he knows that and mistakenly typed "Von" instead of "Rocky".

Menelik said:

yes, I was entirely mistaken in thinking I was quoting Von. I am aware of her explicit hostility towards those Black men she calls "nerds" which was why what I thought were her words (which were in no way explicitly hostile in its depiction of "nerds") I added the phrase passive-aggressive to denote an ever-present aggressive stance towards such Black men.

My mistake, Bro Rocky, but one which in no way incriminated you but which inadvertently reinforces the notion that women such as Von are ever-dependent on straw men, and false constructions, in order to conceal from themselves, and others, the truly dreadful elements of what passes for Black femininity in the contemporary era.

Just saying lol

Menelik Charles
London UK

Anonymous said...

@Menelik Charles

"My mistake, Bro Rocky, but one which in no way incriminated you..."

Amazing how YOU quote ROCKY, (mistaking his quote for VON), and BASH his argument (while thinking it's VON), but then turn around and say it in no way incriminated ROCKY. Haha who are you fooling? YOU DIRECTLY INCRIMINATED ROCKY.

Classic!

Andrew said...

Man listen..

Von is financially supporting an African nerd in "grad school. Am I correct? I wonder if "he thinks" she owes him something? She sure is coming out her pocket for him. That young hood rat just plays tough on her blog.

The only place her fiancée took her was the "Waffle House" in Atlanta. She remind of that knucklehead lawyer on "desperate housewives of Atlanta' married to an ex con. The white girl Kim said "At least I am not married to an ex con".

I won't apologize to a rat that who is not practicing what 'she preaches".

Rocky said...

Haha who are you fooling? YOU DIRECTLY INCRIMINATED ROCKY

Not at all. The same statement coming from two different perspectives can mean two different things. From Von, it means categorizing men who take a position she doesn’t like as “nerds” and then bashing “nerds”. From me, it is a case of showing that most of the men she is categorizing as “nerds” are actually not nerds. A true nerd would be less inclined to criticize women but would more likely be inclined to be very accommodating of women. Someone like Menelik , Andrew, the men from Black Men Vent, Sergeant Willie, Thugtician, etc. are not nerds, geeks, squares, etc.

There is nothing wrong with being a “nerd”. Nerds generally end up being successful people and they contribute enormously to societal advancement. Most would be committed husbands and fathers. But true male nerds are often well outside of the mainstream social circle where the most physically desirable women tend to reside and they often try to compensate by being “nice” and accommodating to these women. Thus, male nerds would be more likely to be pro-feminism and less critical of women’s behavior.

Understand that this is a male oriented blog. We are not going to have the cat fights you have on your blog and blogs like it. We understand each other and even if we do disagree on something, it's no big deal.

Menelik Charles said...

Anonymous said:

Amazing how YOU quote ROCKY, (mistaking his quote for VON), and BASH his argument (while thinking it's VON), but then turn around and say it in no way incriminated ROCKY. Haha who are you fooling? YOU DIRECTLY INCRIMINATED ROCKY.

Menelik asks:

have you ever had a conversation in which nuance was present? Is every conversational encounter you have with an opponent gladiatorial in nature?

What is wrong with you, woman?!?!?

Woman up!

Menelik Charles
London UK

Kid W/Golden Arms said...

Vons rant about "nerds" is not so much about nerds as much as it is about invalidating the opinions of men via emasculation. White america wishes they could make all black men social nerds....as long as they are not intelligent enough to own their own shit.....

she is really painting all the men (who criticize these womens choices in men ONLY when they complain about the men they have chosen) as if they are a non-issue...

its more ad hominem stuff....

Anonymous said...

@julia

good pick up.
Polow is half asian and prefers white women aka King of white girls.

Why should we care about what he thinks?

I find it funny that you called him a dog!

Damn girl! Julia goes HAM!!

Its good to see that because more black females need to think like you. Maybe if they did, they wouldn’t get knocked up by polows. I cant get over the dog part! Its funny but true. The more I look at him the more he looks like one. Like I said, im glad girls like you are around. Lol you gave him no kind of compliment and refused to do so. Here I am thinking I am the only one.

That’s good. And your parents raised you right. now I can see how and why you end up with a white guy. I don’t think black males impress you like that. Only your family.
@Rocky
I thought thugs were the problem?

Why you pushing hard for Polow to be attractive. Hes a thug, what does it matter?

Anonymous said...

Just to add on the thing with Menelik shows how is he biased.

When it was Von she was all this shit and he went on a rant but when he was told the words were Rockys…he went and changed his view and people jumped to defend his “mistake”. It goes to show that menelik cant give fair opinions without including his biased and judgmental feelings towards said individuals.

Andrew said...

Dear Kid

I agree with you. If you a smart "Negro" the white folks do not want to talk to you.

I don't know if it is "intentional". I rarely held a conversation with a white guy once he found out I don't use Ebonics.

Currently, at my job, the white boys like to use black slang like "word" or "other black slang". I don't use that language at all.

I guess this is how they relate to black men. I had a white guy tell me some story about being in the "hood" and how it was the "jungle". I guess it was a badge of honor to survive the "hood". I sort of looked at him and said "Na I was raised near Long Island actually". He never said anything after that. A black man in the suburbs "it was sort of shocking".

I got nothing in common with them. Even, when I was living in a "rural white town in PA". It was a small group of educated people in that town (those with a BA or better). The rest of the town was "white trash". Except for the Principal of the school in which I worked. He was one of those privileged white guys but he "didn't show it". You know with the "blonde wife", 2 kids, and the "dog that is so well trained". I kind of felt sorry for the dog. He would point at the dog and it wouldn't "move". Let me move on.

That ATL hoodrat is supporting a "nerd' financially. "Hoping" she will get the same investment "in return". Of course, when that does not happen, they will lash out at us. Plus, go on about the virtues of white men while the status quo remains the same. No response or black women "worship" back from white men.

Hence, the white worship continues with sellout black women with no reciprocity in sight by white men. But it will "happen' ONE DAY. They are hoping and praying.

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous

"Why you pushing hard for Polow to be attractive. Hes a thug, what does it matter?"

Exactly both Julia and I pointed this out, but ROCKY seems to be more interested in fighting Von than paying attention to his own contradictions. He doesn't realize he's saying a THUG is attractive.

Rocky said...

I don't know why this anon is continuing to push this straw man by posing as another anon and responding to herself. She is probably Von herself.

What's funny is that she expressed a positive opion of how Ice Cube looks. You know, Ice Cube from NWA? Can't get any more thuggish than that.

Von expressed the view that Thugs tend to be the good looking guys. I recall her specifically saying that "Pookie" usually looks good and that the "nerd" is either ugly are a total social misfit. She then accused guys who criticized black women's dating choices of being ugly, nerds or both.

Polow is no nerd (far from it). Polow is no loser (he's a millionaire producer). Polow is not "ugly". As I showed, when he kept himself up, most women complimented his looks.

Andrew said...

Anonymous said

London is biased. That is funny coming from the BWE bloggers who censor us on their blogs. Von is no exception because she agrees with the BWE bloggers 90 percent of the time.

Yet, they come to my blog and Rocky's blog critiquing what we say.

The bottom line is black women ignored nerds and now it is coming back to bite them.

It is a blow to their ego when a "nerd" uses them for sex and drops them. I personally don't think women can be used for sex. They willingly open their legs for the enjoyment. They just get mad they don't get "more than they expected" monetarily wise or material wise from that man.

Hence, they cry out saying "you used me". They say "successful black men checked out" because he ain't buy me fancy shoes and purses.

Now they want a white man to "foot the bill". They go on and on on their blogs about how the white man is going to give them "everything they want".

Shopping sprees, bills paid, housing and etc.

A bunch of delusional sellouts.

vincee101 said...

First of all who isn't 'flawed?' If one's 'flaws' are the determining factor in identifying what group one belongs to we are all in trouble. Our group would look extremely different from what each of us is accustomed too. Wow, if we can't talk to each other any better than this? Why waste the time. I am an Afro-American man. I quit dealing with big mouthed females a long time ago and my life is a lot more peaceful because of it. Thugs, bad-boys and players are just what they show you they are. The same goes for hoodrats, ghetto girls, hoes and the like. Both groups amount to so much wasted time! Leave them alone!

As for Von, do the same. Rarely are you going to get anything constructive from an opinionated angry person. There are intelligent women who will discuss issues and resort to name calling, temper-tantrums and such whenever it becomes obvious they are wrong. Find those women engage them in like manner and watch what happens.

Anonymous said...

No rocky, two different Anonymous

The only thing I have with Von is that there is no confidentiality. She makes you not want to talk with her or even get to personal because if you piss her off, she ready to write a stupid ass post on you.
Its annoying as fuck and I hate to read them because Im like Von seriously? Is it really that serious? No one can give an opinion on you?

That’s why they don’t like you!!

All in all, she talks a good one but Von is just another light skinned chick that thinks she uppity and better than hood girls but she is just as ghetto and immature.

I like Julia but she is uppity and you can't get anymore uppity than her. She tries hard to be down but it comes out in her fast. like I said, I can see why she married a white guy. She would fit in more.

Whats up with you and Polow? Is he your brother or something??

Mr Laurelton Queens said...

(Eating popcorn)

I am kind of surprised by the backlash on Von. It seems to be coming from her readers. She has the potential to do well. But readers don't like people that are perfect. I think some female readers are sort of resentful of her sly comments towards them because she managed to get engaged.

Now if the marriage happens. Then, you can talk shit. You ain't even walk down the aisle yet. Trust me, men can change their mind at the last minute. I did that before.

Anyway, Julia is not uppity. That is the dynamic that puzzles me about sellout black women. They will knock one of "their own" even when she is married to a white guy (most of the sellout bw can't even get a date with a white guy).

You know why they knock Julia? Because she associates herself with black men or the black male bloggers.

The sellout BWE bloggers just can't be happy for her. It is a twisted way of thinking. Yea "get a white guy". Oh yea, by the way bash black men until the end of time.

It is amazing to me they can even keep a relationship with a white guy the way they talk about black men.

I never take them serious. Most of them still have their legs up in the air for a black man sexually. They just won't tell you that.

They will say "oh I have know drew (my name) or "Tyrone" or "Marlon" for x amount of years or months. So it is okay to fuck them because I know them.

But they so called love white men.

Child please.

Menelik Charles said...

@ Anon 1 & anon 2,

ever heard of the phrase 'split personality'?

I'll be interested to know which side of you answers this question lol

Kid W/Golden Arms said...

this is just another case of a crazy person trying to change definitions to suit their agenda...its obvious her definitions do not apply, she is depending on the force of her emotion and imagination upon others...kinda like a television producer...

Menelik Charles said...

Kid W/ Golden said:

Von's rant about "nerds" is not so much about nerds as much as it is about invalidating the opinions of men via emasculation. White America wishes they could make all black men social nerds....

Menelik says:

but the weird thing about all this is that brothers are increasingly laying this Von-like attitude at the foot of feminism. Its absolute nonsense! Feminism hasn't ravished the femininity of most American women, has it?

Keep in mind, that because many women maybe self-entitled, selfish etc it doesn't follow that they're feminists. Its a bit like saying that a 'marauding pack of Black youths' attacking innocent white people are somehow Black nationalists revolutionaries: they ain't, man!

My point is that Von is borne of matriarchy NOT feminism. One is independent of the other. Matriarchy doesn't need feminism to rule and control something it already rules and controls i.e. men, children, the family and, to a lessor extent, the community.

White feminists consider the stereotypical Black woman to be strong. Why? because of feminism? No. Because of their matriarchal tradition which fundamentally de-femininises Black women.

Enter stage door left, madame Von, and her posse of impossible-to-live-with sistas!

Menelik Charles
London UK

Kid W/Golden Arms said...

@ Menelik Charles

******************
but the weird thing about all this is that brothers are increasingly laying this Von-like attitude at the foot of feminism. Its absolute nonsense! Feminism hasn't ravished the femininity of most American women, has it?
*******************

I find this to be true. I think alot of us are confused as to what happened and where we went wrong. In truth feminism is one thing on top of many that made our collective situation much worse. I see you have a solid grasp on the overall issues regarding the women, but what of the men? What do you think are some major faults of the general group?

Menelik Charles said...

@ Kid W,

to be honest, much of the criticisms sistas make of the brothers are valid. We're far from perfect. However, what may invalidate these criticism are the characters of the women who level these criticism at us.

Look at it like this: if a friend levels a justifiable criticism at you then you're more likely to accept it as valid since it comes from a 'good place' i.e. a friend.

However, the same criticism coming from an opponent (who may also seek to ally herself with your racial opponents) will not only put you on the defensive (because your opponent means you no good) but also compel you to look at the character of that opponent.

Cases in point here are the likes of the extraordinary fantasists Evia, and Sara, plus the "honorary Aryan", LorMarie.

The irony of such wicked women criticizing Black men (usually for no other reason that they represent their "no good" fathers)) is that most of their masculine flaws stem from growing up in matriarchal homes (often even with a father present), and so are groomed to leave the business of working, studying, and raising children, to females while they're off chasing their illusive manhood.

So, yeah, we bros got issues but few if any are attached to having kinky hair, negroid features, or of not fitting America's idea of what beauty is etc. We simply need more men to stick around in their children's lives, and so counter-balance this matriarchal nonsense.

It's gonna happen, bro!

Menelik Charles
London UK

Kid W/Golden Arms said...

Dr.J and others are on point with this one.

High-Conflict and Abusive Personality-Disordered Women: The Emotional Judging Mind Vs. the Discerning Mind

http://www.shrink4men.com/2011/01/17/high-conflict-and-abusive-personality-disordered-women-the-emotional-judging-mind-vs-the-discerning-mind/

La Reyna said...

Menelik, Rocky, et.al,

The sellouts are out to get Obsidian as well to cosign on the "something new" ideology. He ain't having it and I'm glad that he stood up to Jamilla on that score. No whie man is going to take on her baggage, especially when she had an out of wedlock kid while at the same time promoting reactionary views about Blacks, esp. Black men.

http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com/entry/64738

Go read it for yourselves.

La Reyna